HobieHernandez
New Member
Is this it??The new Hang out??nice atmosphere....
New checkmate site??
- Thread starter HobieHernandez
- Start date
Old Hickory
New Member
Hobie,
I'm like you; don't get over here very often.... have to make more of an effort.
Hick
I'm like you; don't get over here very often.... have to make more of an effort.
Hick
Cooperider
Active Member
This is an everyboat site.
Thanks Guys - I'm glad you like our other joint.
This site was originally set up for y'all to use, so I hope you'll pop in once in a while and show us all your non-Checkmate floating stuff.
I'm always adding a few pictures of this, or scans of that each day, or two, so pop around regularly and don't be a stranger.
Sorry the Check site updates took a little longer than usual, it turned out to be the update from hell for some reason. All should be good now though.
-Chris
This site was originally set up for y'all to use, so I hope you'll pop in once in a while and show us all your non-Checkmate floating stuff.
I'm always adding a few pictures of this, or scans of that each day, or two, so pop around regularly and don't be a stranger.
Sorry the Check site updates took a little longer than usual, it turned out to be the update from hell for some reason. All should be good now though.
-Chris
TEAMBAJA
Member
What do you think of all the Beckmate controversy?
-Chris
Its getting confusing to be quite honest. I can understand if someone doesnt like that particular design, but come on.......its just one model in the line up. And its built to Checkmates usual standards. I will tell you straight up their gel work is far superior to anything Baja ever put out. Baja dealers have dropped like flys in the past year, we all know thats a fact. 2 of the most recent were the oldest Baja dealer and the largest. I hope the 244 ZT will give them an option to fill that void, and the option for Checkmate to showcase their whole lineup.
I think part of the "big-deal" for the Checkmate guys, is that there has been this underlying fear that Doug will turn Checkmate into Baja. And I would say the main reason they don't want that development, is that they feel Baja had inferior construction and quality as compared to 'Mate.
Beyond the obvious of Doug just buying Checkmate, there have been a number of small things that have helped to further fuel that fear.
So now for these couple of boats to go into production, which would appear to be built using old Baja moulds, the fear of Checkmate becoming the new Baja has hit a fever pitch. So I think that's what we're seeing with the Mate guys. If the underlying fear of Mate turning into Baja could be eliminated, I think many of the Mate fans would probably take a less emotional view of these new hulls.
At the end of the day, I guess we'll just have to wait and see where Doug plans to take the company.
-Chris
Beyond the obvious of Doug just buying Checkmate, there have been a number of small things that have helped to further fuel that fear.
So now for these couple of boats to go into production, which would appear to be built using old Baja moulds, the fear of Checkmate becoming the new Baja has hit a fever pitch. So I think that's what we're seeing with the Mate guys. If the underlying fear of Mate turning into Baja could be eliminated, I think many of the Mate fans would probably take a less emotional view of these new hulls.
At the end of the day, I guess we'll just have to wait and see where Doug plans to take the company.
-Chris
TEAMBAJA
Member
I think you hit the nail on the head.
Something else that I havent seen discussed anywhere is is Checkmates drastic need for some updated boats. Thats been the biggest complaint Ive heard for years. Some of the new boats coming out of there before Smith took over were so dated looking, especially the interiors. Thats one area Baja was far superior. Ive even had other manufacturers tell me that at magazine tests when were hanging out talking. I couldnt tell you how many people at the Sea Ray factory told me that when I delivered a Baja built Sea Ray to Merrit Island.
TB- I agree whole heartily w/ your statement that Mate needed to update their interiors and paint schemes. I've been very impressed w/ the updates that DS has done so far since he bought the company.
Things really never changed the last 10 yrs of the Combs era. But look at all of the old school boat companies that are still in business- Progression, Sutphen, SuperBoat, Pantera, Tuff, etc. In my opinion, Combs made what he wanted to make and sold what he wanted to sell all without the backing of a billion $ conglomerate behind him. It must of worked since they were in business over 45+ yrs. Does Mr Smith or Baja have that track record? I think you will soon see other Baja molds used and the Cm designs pushed out the back.
I also agree the main concern that CM fans have is that DS will turn Cmate into Baja II. I've never posted this openly on the cm site but I think it was a bad business decision to rebrand the H2X as the ZT244.
Things really never changed the last 10 yrs of the Combs era. But look at all of the old school boat companies that are still in business- Progression, Sutphen, SuperBoat, Pantera, Tuff, etc. In my opinion, Combs made what he wanted to make and sold what he wanted to sell all without the backing of a billion $ conglomerate behind him. It must of worked since they were in business over 45+ yrs. Does Mr Smith or Baja have that track record? I think you will soon see other Baja molds used and the Cm designs pushed out the back.
I also agree the main concern that CM fans have is that DS will turn Cmate into Baja II. I've never posted this openly on the cm site but I think it was a bad business decision to rebrand the H2X as the ZT244.
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Well for me, I'm not going to lie, I've had some fun and participated to some degree over the years, with the whole Baja-Checkmate rivalry. But I can also honestly say I've never taken it all too seriously either. The bottom line for me, is that I spend more time in my Tin boat than my Check.
For me, there came a time when I saw that a few too many people were taking the whole rivalry thing a little too seriously, so I made a concious decision to stay out of it for the most part, as it seemed to be counter-productive.
Now personally speaking, I believe there is good that can be taken from both Baja and Checkmate.
With Checkmate, I prefer Checkmate's construction methods with hand laid balsa-core construction and also their glass and gel work. I also like that Checkmate still have a strong outboard offering. I'm basically a cottager, so I prefer outboards. And I like the pad v-bottom outboards Checkmate has built for many years like the current Pulsare line. And style wise, I like the somewhat classic design of the Mate's. It's not trendy or today's big thing I know, but it also ain't gonna be yesterday's news tomorrow either.
Conversely, I can appreciate Baja's more agressive and effective marketing of their product, with fancy brochures, websites etc. I also appreciate that they refresh their product on an almost annual basis, with regular updates to colors, graphic packages etc. I also like that Baja offer some bigger I/O models, although I myself will probably never buy one. And yes, Baja's interiors were/are more updated and let's face it, you can't really go wrong with McCleod.
Now in the end, I believe if Doug takes the good from both products and puts them together, he'll probably be successful. A better economy is going to be needed too of course!
However, if he attempts to turn Checkmate into his old Baja, I believe he'll end up up repeating history all over again.
-Chris
For me, there came a time when I saw that a few too many people were taking the whole rivalry thing a little too seriously, so I made a concious decision to stay out of it for the most part, as it seemed to be counter-productive.
Now personally speaking, I believe there is good that can be taken from both Baja and Checkmate.
With Checkmate, I prefer Checkmate's construction methods with hand laid balsa-core construction and also their glass and gel work. I also like that Checkmate still have a strong outboard offering. I'm basically a cottager, so I prefer outboards. And I like the pad v-bottom outboards Checkmate has built for many years like the current Pulsare line. And style wise, I like the somewhat classic design of the Mate's. It's not trendy or today's big thing I know, but it also ain't gonna be yesterday's news tomorrow either.
Conversely, I can appreciate Baja's more agressive and effective marketing of their product, with fancy brochures, websites etc. I also appreciate that they refresh their product on an almost annual basis, with regular updates to colors, graphic packages etc. I also like that Baja offer some bigger I/O models, although I myself will probably never buy one. And yes, Baja's interiors were/are more updated and let's face it, you can't really go wrong with McCleod.
Now in the end, I believe if Doug takes the good from both products and puts them together, he'll probably be successful. A better economy is going to be needed too of course!
However, if he attempts to turn Checkmate into his old Baja, I believe he'll end up up repeating history all over again.
-Chris
TEAMBAJA
Member
Your right Chris. Its like Chevy Vs Ford. Ive always driven Chevys and had fun giving the Ford guys a hard time, and they would in return. But I never took it too serious obviously since I have owned Fords too. I think its ok for people to express their opinions on the 244/H2X. Whats NOT ok is a guy like "BIG RED" looking for reasons to start sh*t on every board. He goes by at least 3 screen names that I know of (BIG RED, Purple Hornet, DICK HOLIDAY), and has a pattern of picking one person to harass. He harassed Dock Holiday till he just quit posting, then he moved on to me. I fell for the his little game and argued with him for awhile (you know the thread) till I realized what was going on. I gracefully exited and immediately he started in on Tristar on OSO. Now I see he has a picture of me in his signature line. WTF is that all about? Why he is still on the boards is a mystery to me.
Actually, in real life, Jayme's alright. His heart is in the right place most of the time.
I think he just likes to stir the pot a bit, get things moving and have some fun on the boards. I don't think he takes things as seriously as it looks like he does.
I know for the most part, when he realizes someone is really getting hurt or taking him seriously, he backs off.
He's probably the best guy to speak for himself though.
-Chris
I think he just likes to stir the pot a bit, get things moving and have some fun on the boards. I don't think he takes things as seriously as it looks like he does.
I know for the most part, when he realizes someone is really getting hurt or taking him seriously, he backs off.
He's probably the best guy to speak for himself though.
-Chris
I agree that Bred was taking stuff personally and being very exhuberant in his posts about the new 244ZT. But like Chris said, Jaymie is the first one on the CM board to give people help or advice on lots of issues.
Greg, you also must admit that Doc and a few other people were being cheerleaders about the new Beckmate on OSO. I personally feel like it was being rubbed in the face of Checkmate owners. It was like the shoe was on the other foot from the Fountian/ Baja aquisition. I've only met Doc one time at the LKN FallRun and he was very pleasant to talk to about boats. But I think he needs to learn (in my opinion) that not everyone is going to agree w/ his enthuesism. He no longer posts on TBM, Bfreaks, and now OSO.
Just my thoughts......the next time I'm in town we need to drink beers at Bakers and resolve all the issues of the boating world!
Greg, you also must admit that Doc and a few other people were being cheerleaders about the new Beckmate on OSO. I personally feel like it was being rubbed in the face of Checkmate owners. It was like the shoe was on the other foot from the Fountian/ Baja aquisition. I've only met Doc one time at the LKN FallRun and he was very pleasant to talk to about boats. But I think he needs to learn (in my opinion) that not everyone is going to agree w/ his enthuesism. He no longer posts on TBM, Bfreaks, and now OSO.
Just my thoughts......the next time I'm in town we need to drink beers at Bakers and resolve all the issues of the boating world!
Well, I don't know Doc at all. I don't think he's a member of either of my sites. I just know him from seeing him posting on OSO and getting beaten up on some other sites.
Who knows? Maybe he'll join up here at some point.
I think what's currently happening with Doc, is that some have perceived he was leaking propaganda that he got from Checkmate Management. Now whether he was prodded to leak the info, or whether he decided to leak it on his own, only he knows.
Then seemingly, when the info that was leaked, seemingly seem to back-fire, the thread mysteriously was deleted.
So I think part of what is going on, is that a few people are attempting to send a message to Mate management through Doc.
-Chris
Who knows? Maybe he'll join up here at some point.
I think what's currently happening with Doc, is that some have perceived he was leaking propaganda that he got from Checkmate Management. Now whether he was prodded to leak the info, or whether he decided to leak it on his own, only he knows.
Then seemingly, when the info that was leaked, seemingly seem to back-fire, the thread mysteriously was deleted.
So I think part of what is going on, is that a few people are attempting to send a message to Mate management through Doc.
-Chris